Forum » Problemi človeštva » NATO in Rusija
NATO in Rusija
Temo vidijo: vsi
Pac-Man ::
Kar se mene tiče, dopuščam visoko stopnjo verjetnosti, da je malezijca zrušil ruski Buk... kdo pa je s to mašino upravljal? Ruska izšolana posadka takega kapitalnega felerja zagotovo ne bi naredila.
A vse to smo po dolgem in počez obdelali v temi o MH17. Tudi moja domneva o krivdi Rusov/LNR je le domneva, saj je nedvoumnih dokazov bore malo in tudi nizozemska preiskava ni povedala nič bistveno več kot bolj ali manj utemeljeno domnevo o vrsti protiletalske rakete, ki naj bi povzročila sestrelitev letala.
Vidiš, saj znaš.
Buk se je peljal skozi Luhansk, rusko obrambno ministrstvo je na tiskovni konferenci lagalo.
Našli smo tudi en kos objektivne resnice.
Zdaj zberi samo dovolj volje, da boš to zmogel brez na pladnju serviranih detajlov.
Kar se ostalega tiče, Buk je na obisk prišel s posadko, "z ekipažem" @2:00
in prav tako odšel, @10:50
Celemu transportu po Ukrajini so sledili, ker so imeli idioti v spremstvu prižgane telefone.
The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or
the convinced Communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and
fiction and the distinction between true and false no longer exist.
the convinced Communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and
fiction and the distinction between true and false no longer exist.
Pac-Man ::
Seveda je možna tudi razlaga, da so malezijca sestrelili Ukrajinci.
Ki so menda tudi imeli Buk baterije?
To make Russia look bad.
Dokler se najde živa priče z ene ali druge strani.
Ki pa seveda lahko tudi laže?
Zagotovo ne bomo nikoli zagotovo vedeli.
TRUE/FALSE is blowing in the wind.
Razen za Pacota &Co.
Oni VEJO!
In spet metafizika.
So žive priče, ki so videle izstrelitev.
https://mh17.correctiv.org/english/
After long knocks a villager opens his front door. “Are you a spy?” is his first question after a quick introduction. The man fled town in August because of the fighting. But on July 17th 2014 he was here. Any question about this day scares him.
“I remember, but you know I will not tell you everything. That could end badly for me.” The CORRECT!V journalist introduces himself—and shows identification. He says that he is here to learn more. The people in Europe want to know what happened, why so many people had to die here in Ukraine, shot down in a peaceful airplane.
The man hesitates. Then he starts to talk: “They shot it down with a missile. They launched the missile from here. We saw it, as it flew.”
He points to the railway embankment. A friend of his had already seen the missile. “He phoned me and said, ‘there’s this amazing thing here with four missiles.’” The friend will also remain unnamed. “He is afraid. These are dangerous times.” But one question still bothers the witness. “They planned everything. I just don’t know why they brought it here?”
He continues. “I was in the yard and I heard an explosion, a bang. There was a bang. My roof tiles shook. The bang came from over there, it was easy to hear. Then there was a long sound. And then a very loud explosion: bang, bang. And just as I ran out into the road, the plane began to fall. Down the road several kilometers from here. Do you understand? And you could see it burn.”
Asked about the loud bang, the witness had an explanation. “It launched from over there,” he said.
When asked whether Russian soldiers or separatists fired the missile, the man laughs. For him the rocket launch could only be executed by Russian soldiers. “Now, what miner launches missiles? They were specialists. Can I launch a missile?”
This witness completes the picture: it was a BUK M1 rocket that brought the passenger plane out of the sky – brought into position by soldiers of the 53rd air defense brigade from Kursk who were in the city of Snizhne without national markings to protect Russian tank units.
Za sojenje se opremi z antidepresivi.
The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or
the convinced Communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and
fiction and the distinction between true and false no longer exist.
the convinced Communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and
fiction and the distinction between true and false no longer exist.
D3m ::
This witness completes the picture: it was a BUK M1 rocket that brought the passenger plane out of the sky
Ne zna upravljati s sistemom. Ve pa kateri model je sestrelilo letalo.
Komedija so te tvoje povezave Paco.
|HP EliteBook|R5 6650U|
Pac-Man ::
Nauči se brat, gre za mnenje avtorja.
Nizozemska policija:
https://www.politie.nl/en/news/2016/sep...
Video buka v Donetsku:
https://www.politie.nl/binaries/content...
video buka v Torezu, meni ne špila v brskalniku, po DL deluje v playerju:
https://www.politie.nl/binaries/content...
The investigation demonstrated that flight MH17 was shot down by a 9M38 series BUK missile. Investigators have compared parts of the alleged weapon which were found at the crash site with reference material. This involved the dismantling of various types of BUK missiles from the 9M38 series and comparing this reference material with the metal parts recovered from the crash site.
...
During the autopsy of the bodies of the cockpit crew, several fragments were found that belonged to the warhead of a 9M38 series BUK missile. One of these fragments found showed traces of cockpit glass on the surface, which was the same unique type of glass that is used for the a Boeing 777.
...
In the frame of one of the cockpit windows a metal piece was found which was identified as a part of a 9M38 series BUK missile.
...
The JIT has been able to identify a large part of the route concerning the arrival and the departure of the BUK-TELAR. This was the result of intercepted telephone conversations, witness statements, photographs and videos that had been posted on social media, and a video never shown before which was obtained from a witness. The system was transported from Russian territory into eastern Ukraine and was later transported on a white Volvo truck with a low-boy trailer.
...
The final destination of the BUK-system was on farmland near Pervomaiskyi. Evidence that supports this includes multiple witnesses who saw and photographed the condensation trail of the BUK missile and its movement through the air. Other witnesses were able to link the trail to the BUK-TELAR which they had seen earlier on 17 July 2014.
Witnesses were interviewed who had seen a plume of smoke, the BUK-TELAR at the launch site in Pervomaiskyi, and the missile right after it had been launched.
...
So far, the JIT has identified approximately 100 people who can be linked to the downing of MH17 or the transport of the BUK-TELAR. The JIT has been investigating these people through various sources, such as intercepted telephone conversations and witness statements.
In addition, an investigation is conducted into the chain of command. Who gave the order to bring the BUK-TELAR into Ukraine and who gave the order to shoot down flight MH17?
Nizozemska policija:
https://www.politie.nl/en/news/2016/sep...
Video buka v Donetsku:
https://www.politie.nl/binaries/content...
video buka v Torezu, meni ne špila v brskalniku, po DL deluje v playerju:
https://www.politie.nl/binaries/content...
The investigation demonstrated that flight MH17 was shot down by a 9M38 series BUK missile. Investigators have compared parts of the alleged weapon which were found at the crash site with reference material. This involved the dismantling of various types of BUK missiles from the 9M38 series and comparing this reference material with the metal parts recovered from the crash site.
...
During the autopsy of the bodies of the cockpit crew, several fragments were found that belonged to the warhead of a 9M38 series BUK missile. One of these fragments found showed traces of cockpit glass on the surface, which was the same unique type of glass that is used for the a Boeing 777.
...
In the frame of one of the cockpit windows a metal piece was found which was identified as a part of a 9M38 series BUK missile.
...
The JIT has been able to identify a large part of the route concerning the arrival and the departure of the BUK-TELAR. This was the result of intercepted telephone conversations, witness statements, photographs and videos that had been posted on social media, and a video never shown before which was obtained from a witness. The system was transported from Russian territory into eastern Ukraine and was later transported on a white Volvo truck with a low-boy trailer.
...
The final destination of the BUK-system was on farmland near Pervomaiskyi. Evidence that supports this includes multiple witnesses who saw and photographed the condensation trail of the BUK missile and its movement through the air. Other witnesses were able to link the trail to the BUK-TELAR which they had seen earlier on 17 July 2014.
Witnesses were interviewed who had seen a plume of smoke, the BUK-TELAR at the launch site in Pervomaiskyi, and the missile right after it had been launched.
...
So far, the JIT has identified approximately 100 people who can be linked to the downing of MH17 or the transport of the BUK-TELAR. The JIT has been investigating these people through various sources, such as intercepted telephone conversations and witness statements.
In addition, an investigation is conducted into the chain of command. Who gave the order to bring the BUK-TELAR into Ukraine and who gave the order to shoot down flight MH17?
The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or
the convinced Communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and
fiction and the distinction between true and false no longer exist.
the convinced Communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and
fiction and the distinction between true and false no longer exist.
Pac-Man ::
Šamanov nastopa tu
https://slo-tech.com/forum/t654718/p581...
Vladimir Shamanov @ Wikipedia
Vladimir Anatolyevich Shamanov (Russian: Владимир Анатольевич Шаманов, born 1957) is a retired Colonel General of the Russian Armed Forces, who was Commander-in-Chief of the Russian Airborne Troops from May 2009[1] to October 2016 and a former Russian politician. After his retirement in October 2016, Shamanov became head of the State Duma Defense Committee.
Vladimir Shamanov is a recipient of the Hero of the Russian Federation decoration for his service in Chechnya, but has been strongly criticized by human rights groups for alleged war crimes committed by the federal troops under his orders during the First and Second Chechen Wars.
...
In November 2007, his impending return to the military service was announced.[2]
In August 2008, he commanded the Russian forces in Abkhazia during the 2008 South Ossetia war with Georgia.[3] On August 12, 2008 he took control over 9,600 Russian servicemen in Abkhazia and led them during the fight with Georgian forces over the control over the Upper Kodori Gorge.[4][5]
On 26 May 2009 Vladimir Shamanov became the new commander of the VDV, replacing Lieutenant-General Valeriy Yevtukhovich who was being discharged to the reserve.
...
Shamanov has an image of an "over-the-top" ruthless man among the other Russian military leaders, with certain insurgency-related sources calling him the "Butcher of Chechnya."
...
As Gennady Troshev, another Russian commander in Chechnya, wrote in his book My War, Shamanov "was too hot-tempered and direct in his relations with the Chechen population" [preferring] "to choose the shortest way to victory (...) [which] resulted in numerous casualties among Russian soldiers."[11]
Aslambek Aslakhanov, a retired MVD general who was Vladimir Putin's advisor on Chechnya, called Shamanov a "butcher" and a "one-man curse on the Chechen people": "Chechens talk about Shamanov like a plague that has descended on their heads, a disease like AIDS. He is drowning in blood. He cynically believes that all Chechens – men and women, even children – are bandits."[12]
The director of the Moscow office of Memorial, the human rights group founded by the late Nobel Peace Prize laureate Andrei Sakharov, said: "His subordinates are definitely guilty of war crimes, and I believe a serious investigation would show Shamanov’s direct guilt in war crimes as well, that he ordered them. He has a serious xenophobic streak. He’s cruel, but it comes from his sense of duty. He’s honest about it, but that doesn’t make it less frightening."
...
In the 2004 The Washington Post interview, Shamanov rejected the allegations as "fairy tales" and suggested that human rights groups had planted the bodies in Alkhan-Yurt and "fabricated" a slaughter.
...
In March 2007 Shamanov met in the White House with the U.S. President George W. Bush, which was criticised by human rights groups.[16][19][20][21] "This isn't someone the U.S. president should be meeting with. This is someone the president should be calling for an investigation of," HRW commented.
...
In September 2010, MOD Serdyukov helped Shamanov out of a scandal when he tried to order a detachment from the VDV’s 45th Independent Reconnaissance Regiment to detain an investigator looking into the business of his son-in-law Anatoly "Glyba" Khramushin, a well-known criminal figure. Shamanov had to admit to "inappropriate behaviour" and only got a reprimand for this incident.
Saker je popolnoma pro-ruski, kar ve vsak, ki spremlja Ukrajino in Sirijo. No, l. 2010 je objavil to:
http://vineyardsaker.blogspot.com/2010/...
First, a "leak" was published in a Russian tabloid accusing Shamanov of using two Spetsnaz units from the 45th Special Forces Reconnaissance Regiment in Kubinka to defend the interests of Shamanov's son in law, Alexei Khramushin, a well-known "businessman" who currently has an international arrest warrant (for murder) issued against him. Although nothing actually happened that day, a "declassified" (??) recording of what appeared as an intercepted and decrypted telephone conversation between Shamanov and one of his aides was leaked to the Russian tabloid Novaia Gazeta in which Shamanov can be heard ordering 2 Spetsnaz units sent to a business center belonging to Khramushin to prevent an inspection by judicial authorities. When questioned about that, Shamanov answered that this recording had been a clever montage of a real conversation made by individuals with connections to Chechnia.
...
The entourage of General Shamanov then initiated their own investigation into who exactly what behind the so-called "recording" and who gave it to the media.
Now, to top if all off, Shamanov has been involved in a very serious car accident in which a truck suddenly crossed the road and slammed into Shamanov's car even though the road was flat and empty at the time of the accident.
...
The driver and passenger of the truck, both citizens of Tajikistan, first attempted to escape away from the place of the accident but where soon arrested. The driver - Dovladsho Elbigiev - now claims that he was trying to avoid some "other vehicle" when he veered straight into Shamanov's car.
Coincidence?
Hardly. This much rather looks like a typical campaign of the security services to discredit or even kill a dangerous opponent. We can now expect the two Tajiks to be sentenced for manslaughter and sent to some remote prison where everybody will forget about them. Shamanov and his aide will probably survive, but he will be retired for "health reasons" (with honors, of course!), and some super-pliable "yes sir!" kind of general will replace him as the head of the Airborne Forces.
...
In the meantime, the corporate press is the West has not reported about this story at all, not a single word. They are, after all, busy discussion stuff like "terrorist plots" to ship bombs to US synagogues from Yemen via airmail...
What else is new?
Nič ne reče stabilna država s svetlo prihodnostjo, kot poskusi atentatov znotraj generalštaba. Resnični ali ne.
https://slo-tech.com/forum/t654718/p581...
Vladimir Shamanov @ Wikipedia
Vladimir Anatolyevich Shamanov (Russian: Владимир Анатольевич Шаманов, born 1957) is a retired Colonel General of the Russian Armed Forces, who was Commander-in-Chief of the Russian Airborne Troops from May 2009[1] to October 2016 and a former Russian politician. After his retirement in October 2016, Shamanov became head of the State Duma Defense Committee.
Vladimir Shamanov is a recipient of the Hero of the Russian Federation decoration for his service in Chechnya, but has been strongly criticized by human rights groups for alleged war crimes committed by the federal troops under his orders during the First and Second Chechen Wars.
...
In November 2007, his impending return to the military service was announced.[2]
In August 2008, he commanded the Russian forces in Abkhazia during the 2008 South Ossetia war with Georgia.[3] On August 12, 2008 he took control over 9,600 Russian servicemen in Abkhazia and led them during the fight with Georgian forces over the control over the Upper Kodori Gorge.[4][5]
On 26 May 2009 Vladimir Shamanov became the new commander of the VDV, replacing Lieutenant-General Valeriy Yevtukhovich who was being discharged to the reserve.
...
Shamanov has an image of an "over-the-top" ruthless man among the other Russian military leaders, with certain insurgency-related sources calling him the "Butcher of Chechnya."
...
As Gennady Troshev, another Russian commander in Chechnya, wrote in his book My War, Shamanov "was too hot-tempered and direct in his relations with the Chechen population" [preferring] "to choose the shortest way to victory (...) [which] resulted in numerous casualties among Russian soldiers."[11]
Aslambek Aslakhanov, a retired MVD general who was Vladimir Putin's advisor on Chechnya, called Shamanov a "butcher" and a "one-man curse on the Chechen people": "Chechens talk about Shamanov like a plague that has descended on their heads, a disease like AIDS. He is drowning in blood. He cynically believes that all Chechens – men and women, even children – are bandits."[12]
The director of the Moscow office of Memorial, the human rights group founded by the late Nobel Peace Prize laureate Andrei Sakharov, said: "His subordinates are definitely guilty of war crimes, and I believe a serious investigation would show Shamanov’s direct guilt in war crimes as well, that he ordered them. He has a serious xenophobic streak. He’s cruel, but it comes from his sense of duty. He’s honest about it, but that doesn’t make it less frightening."
...
In the 2004 The Washington Post interview, Shamanov rejected the allegations as "fairy tales" and suggested that human rights groups had planted the bodies in Alkhan-Yurt and "fabricated" a slaughter.
...
In March 2007 Shamanov met in the White House with the U.S. President George W. Bush, which was criticised by human rights groups.[16][19][20][21] "This isn't someone the U.S. president should be meeting with. This is someone the president should be calling for an investigation of," HRW commented.
...
In September 2010, MOD Serdyukov helped Shamanov out of a scandal when he tried to order a detachment from the VDV’s 45th Independent Reconnaissance Regiment to detain an investigator looking into the business of his son-in-law Anatoly "Glyba" Khramushin, a well-known criminal figure. Shamanov had to admit to "inappropriate behaviour" and only got a reprimand for this incident.
Saker je popolnoma pro-ruski, kar ve vsak, ki spremlja Ukrajino in Sirijo. No, l. 2010 je objavil to:
http://vineyardsaker.blogspot.com/2010/...
First, a "leak" was published in a Russian tabloid accusing Shamanov of using two Spetsnaz units from the 45th Special Forces Reconnaissance Regiment in Kubinka to defend the interests of Shamanov's son in law, Alexei Khramushin, a well-known "businessman" who currently has an international arrest warrant (for murder) issued against him. Although nothing actually happened that day, a "declassified" (??) recording of what appeared as an intercepted and decrypted telephone conversation between Shamanov and one of his aides was leaked to the Russian tabloid Novaia Gazeta in which Shamanov can be heard ordering 2 Spetsnaz units sent to a business center belonging to Khramushin to prevent an inspection by judicial authorities. When questioned about that, Shamanov answered that this recording had been a clever montage of a real conversation made by individuals with connections to Chechnia.
...
The entourage of General Shamanov then initiated their own investigation into who exactly what behind the so-called "recording" and who gave it to the media.
Now, to top if all off, Shamanov has been involved in a very serious car accident in which a truck suddenly crossed the road and slammed into Shamanov's car even though the road was flat and empty at the time of the accident.
...
The driver and passenger of the truck, both citizens of Tajikistan, first attempted to escape away from the place of the accident but where soon arrested. The driver - Dovladsho Elbigiev - now claims that he was trying to avoid some "other vehicle" when he veered straight into Shamanov's car.
Coincidence?
Hardly. This much rather looks like a typical campaign of the security services to discredit or even kill a dangerous opponent. We can now expect the two Tajiks to be sentenced for manslaughter and sent to some remote prison where everybody will forget about them. Shamanov and his aide will probably survive, but he will be retired for "health reasons" (with honors, of course!), and some super-pliable "yes sir!" kind of general will replace him as the head of the Airborne Forces.
...
In the meantime, the corporate press is the West has not reported about this story at all, not a single word. They are, after all, busy discussion stuff like "terrorist plots" to ship bombs to US synagogues from Yemen via airmail...
What else is new?
Nič ne reče stabilna država s svetlo prihodnostjo, kot poskusi atentatov znotraj generalštaba. Resnični ali ne.
The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or
the convinced Communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and
fiction and the distinction between true and false no longer exist.
the convinced Communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and
fiction and the distinction between true and false no longer exist.
Zgodovina sprememb…
- spremenilo: Pac-Man ()
Mr.B ::
Skrajni čas, da se EU loči od NATA in mentalitete prejšnejga stoletja, drugače bomo postali nekonkurenčni tako kot Amerika.
France Rejects Genocide Accusations Against Israel in Gaza,
To accuse the Jewish state of genocide is to cross a moral threshold
To accuse the Jewish state of genocide is to cross a moral threshold
Cervantes ::
Paco pa kar tera svoje kilometerpaste.
Ampak, on je na pravi strani. In on VE.
Že zelo, zelo dolgo nisem nikomur rekel IDIOT.
No, tudi tokrat ne bom.
Lahko si pa mislim.
Ali je pa tudi to... politično nekorektno?
FACT:
Ja, sem star. Ampak zgleda, da bom umrl od smeha, ne zaradi let.
Which is not a bad way to go.
Na FALSE/TRUE anketo pa ne pada.
On je itak TRUE. The one and only.
Ampak, on je na pravi strani. In on VE.
Že zelo, zelo dolgo nisem nikomur rekel IDIOT.
No, tudi tokrat ne bom.
Lahko si pa mislim.
Ali je pa tudi to... politično nekorektno?
FACT:
Ja, sem star. Ampak zgleda, da bom umrl od smeha, ne zaradi let.
Which is not a bad way to go.
Na FALSE/TRUE anketo pa ne pada.
On je itak TRUE. The one and only.
Mr.B ::
Komentarji na novo doktrino ... slej ko prej pozitivni.
But the document also calls to "strengthen the integration of nuclear and non-nuclear military planning", a move critics say will make operational use of limited nuclear weapons more likely.
Tale še hujša :
"Potential adversaries should not doubt our resolve," said Tom Shannon, under secretary for political affairs at state department, adding the US will not conduct nuclear explosive testing unless it deems it "necessary".
But the document also calls to "strengthen the integration of nuclear and non-nuclear military planning", a move critics say will make operational use of limited nuclear weapons more likely.
Tale še hujša :
"Potential adversaries should not doubt our resolve," said Tom Shannon, under secretary for political affairs at state department, adding the US will not conduct nuclear explosive testing unless it deems it "necessary".
France Rejects Genocide Accusations Against Israel in Gaza,
To accuse the Jewish state of genocide is to cross a moral threshold
To accuse the Jewish state of genocide is to cross a moral threshold
Pac-Man ::
https://themoscowtimes.com/articles/rus...
How Russia’s First Married Gay Couple Ended Up Fleeing
...
The saga began on the morning of Jan. 25 when the newlyweds went to a Moscow civil service center to register their marriage in Russia. They had tied the knot earlier in January in Copenhagen, where same-sex marriage is legal.
...
The doctor and medical student brought their marriage documents to the center, where an officer stamped them and, just like that, recognized their union. The whole affair took about five minutes, the couple said.
...
Technically, the recognition of the men’s marriage in Russia conformed with existing legislation. Russian family law does not explicitly define marriage as applying only to heterosexual couples. The country recognizes marriages registered abroad, as long as it is legally valid in the country where the marriage took place and the individuals are not related.
...
The day after their interview, the Rossia-24 state channel broadcast the story, quoting State Duma deputies who called the marriage a sham and demanded that the law be amended.
...
The Interior Ministry, for its part, fired the official who stamped the passports as well as her immediate supervisor.
On Saturday, police showed up at Stotsko’s apartment in Lyubertsy, a city in the Moscow region. They shut off electricity and internet access, demanded that the couple give up their marriage documents and refused to let them leave the apartment. If they did, the police informed their lawyers, the couple would be charged with resisting arrest.
...
Under a YouTube video of the Rossia-24 broadcast, Russians called for the couple’s heads. “Shoot them,” said one. “Burn them,” suggested another.
“The whole country had found out where they were living,” Kochetkov, who escorted the couple to the airport, told The Moscow Times. “There were threats online. I even received a threat from an anonymous caller.”
How Russia’s First Married Gay Couple Ended Up Fleeing
...
The saga began on the morning of Jan. 25 when the newlyweds went to a Moscow civil service center to register their marriage in Russia. They had tied the knot earlier in January in Copenhagen, where same-sex marriage is legal.
...
The doctor and medical student brought their marriage documents to the center, where an officer stamped them and, just like that, recognized their union. The whole affair took about five minutes, the couple said.
...
Technically, the recognition of the men’s marriage in Russia conformed with existing legislation. Russian family law does not explicitly define marriage as applying only to heterosexual couples. The country recognizes marriages registered abroad, as long as it is legally valid in the country where the marriage took place and the individuals are not related.
...
The day after their interview, the Rossia-24 state channel broadcast the story, quoting State Duma deputies who called the marriage a sham and demanded that the law be amended.
...
The Interior Ministry, for its part, fired the official who stamped the passports as well as her immediate supervisor.
On Saturday, police showed up at Stotsko’s apartment in Lyubertsy, a city in the Moscow region. They shut off electricity and internet access, demanded that the couple give up their marriage documents and refused to let them leave the apartment. If they did, the police informed their lawyers, the couple would be charged with resisting arrest.
...
Under a YouTube video of the Rossia-24 broadcast, Russians called for the couple’s heads. “Shoot them,” said one. “Burn them,” suggested another.
“The whole country had found out where they were living,” Kochetkov, who escorted the couple to the airport, told The Moscow Times. “There were threats online. I even received a threat from an anonymous caller.”
The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or
the convinced Communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and
fiction and the distinction between true and false no longer exist.
the convinced Communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and
fiction and the distinction between true and false no longer exist.
Truga ::
Skrajni čas, da se EU loči od NATA in mentalitete prejšnejga stoletja, drugače bomo postali nekonkurenčni tako kot Amerika.
raje brcnimo vn USA
Fritz ::
Skrajni čas, da se EU loči od NATA in mentalitete prejšnejga stoletja, drugače bomo postali nekonkurenčni tako kot Amerika.
raje brcnimo vn USA
Zmogljivosti zveze NATO so 70%+ tiste od ZDA. Edino, kar bi lahko nadomestilo NATO je EU obrambna unija s francoskim jedskim deterentom a so vojaške zmogljivosti EU inferiornejše od ZDA. Za obrambo, v kombinaciji s pametno zunanjo politiko, je to več kot dovolj.
"Težav ne moremo reševati z isto miselnostjo,
kot smo jo imeli, ko smo jih ustvarili."
A. Einstein
kot smo jo imeli, ko smo jih ustvarili."
A. Einstein
fikus_ ::
Problem EU Nata je, da so/smo preveč neenotni in preden se neka odločitev sprejme minejo tedni ali meseci! Sicer se sedaj nekaj dela na enotnem poveljstvu in enotah za hitro posredovanje.
Glede zmogljivosti EU Nato vojske pa smo spet tam, da je preveč razdrobljena in neizkušena od vrha navzdol do zadnjega vojaka. Oprema in komunikacije so bolj ali manj poenotene, problem so različni jeziki, velike razlike med narodi in s tem motivacija, različni interesi posameznih držav, pa še marsikaj.
EU je še vedno preveč razdrobljena in neenotna za učinkovito EU vojsko. Je pa dobro, da se dela na tem.
Glede zmogljivosti EU Nato vojske pa smo spet tam, da je preveč razdrobljena in neizkušena od vrha navzdol do zadnjega vojaka. Oprema in komunikacije so bolj ali manj poenotene, problem so različni jeziki, velike razlike med narodi in s tem motivacija, različni interesi posameznih držav, pa še marsikaj.
EU je še vedno preveč razdrobljena in neenotna za učinkovito EU vojsko. Je pa dobro, da se dela na tem.
Fritz ::
Sprejemanje političnih odločitev glede uporabe vojaških sil tudi v Natu traja kar nekaj časa, kar je tudi prav, saj ne bi bilo dobro, če bi vojaško silo zlahka uporabljali.
Tudi v NATU je vojaštvo iz različnih držav, ki govorijo različne jezike pa zadeva deluje.
EU lahko uporabi izkušnje in koristne reči iz NATA za izgradnjo lastnega obrambnega stebra, je pa res, da se mora prvo odločiti kaj zares hoče, ker denarja in človeških ter materialnih resursov ni dovolj, za dve večji, paralelni strukturi.
Tudi v NATU je vojaštvo iz različnih držav, ki govorijo različne jezike pa zadeva deluje.
EU lahko uporabi izkušnje in koristne reči iz NATA za izgradnjo lastnega obrambnega stebra, je pa res, da se mora prvo odločiti kaj zares hoče, ker denarja in človeških ter materialnih resursov ni dovolj, za dve večji, paralelni strukturi.
"Težav ne moremo reševati z isto miselnostjo,
kot smo jo imeli, ko smo jih ustvarili."
A. Einstein
kot smo jo imeli, ko smo jih ustvarili."
A. Einstein
Smrekar1 ::
Tole bom sam pustil tle:
https://www.newscientist.com/article/21...
To je ena možnost, ja.
Obstaja še ena možnost, da gre za nacionalistično propagando kitajske in gre za samo za velik klasičen top. Velik po modernih standardih, ne po zgodovinskih standardih.
Srednje velika topniška baterija izpred 75 let.
Glede na to, da so jo postavili povsem na premec zadeva vsekakor ni težka, kar postavi pod vprašaj iz česa je pravzaprav narejena. Meni izgleda kot plastična maketa zunanjosti topovske baterije.
Zgodovina sprememb…
- spremenil: Smrekar1 ()
Mr.B ::
France Rejects Genocide Accusations Against Israel in Gaza,
To accuse the Jewish state of genocide is to cross a moral threshold
To accuse the Jewish state of genocide is to cross a moral threshold
Samuel ::
Aham, zdaj ko imajo Kitajci railgun, zdaj je pa cool in super. Kek, lol.
If you notice this notice, you will notice that this notice is
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noticably not worth noticing.
Mr.B ::
Aham, zdaj ko imajo Kitajci railgun, zdaj je pa cool in super. Kek, lol.
Kull je to,
da bo sedaj ZDA ko je potrebno spodbujati gopodarstvo, investirati nekaj 100 biljončkov v pospešitev razvoja oroažarske industrije. Psoledično bodo še naprej nadalejvali stagnacijo konkurenčnosti proti stari celini ter aziji.
France Rejects Genocide Accusations Against Israel in Gaza,
To accuse the Jewish state of genocide is to cross a moral threshold
To accuse the Jewish state of genocide is to cross a moral threshold
fikus_ ::
Ne, ne! Ameriški testni je super duper, da Best, . . .
Kitajski testni na ladji je pa plastik fantastik maketa!
Sem pred časom pisal, da eno je testni top, drugo pa realnost. Nekateri na forumu so tudi malo računali, koliko elektrike je potrebno in podobno. In se je izkazalo, da rabijo kar veliko električno moč v kratkem času.
In opažam, da nekatere boli, da USA niso edine, ki delajo na tej tehnologiji, če prav trdijo, da je Kitajski iz plastike!
Kitajski testni na ladji je pa plastik fantastik maketa!
Sem pred časom pisal, da eno je testni top, drugo pa realnost. Nekateri na forumu so tudi malo računali, koliko elektrike je potrebno in podobno. In se je izkazalo, da rabijo kar veliko električno moč v kratkem času.
In opažam, da nekatere boli, da USA niso edine, ki delajo na tej tehnologiji, če prav trdijo, da je Kitajski iz plastike!
Zgodovina sprememb…
- spremenilo: fikus_ ()
Mr.B ::
Sploh ni pomembno ali je realni ali ne.... Amerika je zadala cilj ene 1.000+ mijard (1 Triljon) v obnovo jjederskega orožja, ter dodatnih nekaj 100+ mijard se tundi kaj dosti ne bo poznalo... Res pa je, da je v prvi hladni vojni imela Amerika samo Rusijo, Kitajska je bila pa tretjerazredni partner EU. danes pač je malo drugače.
France Rejects Genocide Accusations Against Israel in Gaza,
To accuse the Jewish state of genocide is to cross a moral threshold
To accuse the Jewish state of genocide is to cross a moral threshold
Mr.B ::
Ojej pentagon ne ve kam je dal 800 mijonov dolarjev...http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada...
France Rejects Genocide Accusations Against Israel in Gaza,
To accuse the Jewish state of genocide is to cross a moral threshold
To accuse the Jewish state of genocide is to cross a moral threshold
Samuel ::
Ne, ne! Ameriški testni je super duper, da Best, . . .
Kitajski testni na ladji je pa plastik fantastik maketa!
Sem pred časom pisal, da eno je testni top, drugo pa realnost. Nekateri na forumu so tudi malo računali, koliko elektrike je potrebno in podobno. In se je izkazalo, da rabijo kar veliko električno moč v kratkem času.
In opažam, da nekatere boli, da USA niso edine, ki delajo na tej tehnologiji, če prav trdijo, da je Kitajski iz plastike!
1. ameriški je streljal že leta nazaj, kitajski?
2. za railgun rabiš veliko energije.. čudno ladjo so si izbrali Kitajci za tole...
If you notice this notice, you will notice that this notice is
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noticably not worth noticing.
Cervantes ::
Kitajci že vejo, nč skrbet.
Sicer so pa prav oni izumili smodnik.
En railgun, big deal.
Sicer so pa prav oni izumili smodnik.
En railgun, big deal.
Mr.B ::
En railgun trije kontejnerji, big so what, americani so imeli stiri. Ok kontejnerje pa en railgun.Sicer pa pise testing, ne operativna raba..
France Rejects Genocide Accusations Against Israel in Gaza,
To accuse the Jewish state of genocide is to cross a moral threshold
To accuse the Jewish state of genocide is to cross a moral threshold
Smrekar1 ::
Ne, ne! Ameriški testni je super duper, da Best, . . .
Kitajski testni na ladji je pa plastik fantastik maketa!
Jup.
Ta slika razloži zakaj. Če je ne razumeš vedi, da ne razumeš enega izmed štirih najenostavnejših izumov človeštva.
Kitajci že vejo, nč skrbet.
Sicer so pa prav oni izumili smodnik.
Jup. In potem pogrnili v tehnološki vojni z Evropo, ki ga je dobila ~600 let kasneje.
Zgodovina sprememb…
- spremenil: Smrekar1 ()
Mr.B ::
Ne, ne! Ameriški testni je super duper, da Best, . . .
Kitajski testni na ladji je pa plastik fantastik maketa!
Jup.
Ta slika razloži zakaj. Če je ne razumeš vedi, da ne razumeš enega izmed štirih najenostavnejših izumov človeštva.
Kitajci že vejo, nč skrbet.
Sicer so pa prav oni izumili smodnik.
Jup. In potem pogrnili v tehnološki vojni z Evropo, ki ga je dobila ~600 let kasneje.
Obstaja druga stran medelje, ko vpišeš v google "eu gdp growth higher as us". Zaporedje je 1. 2. 3. Kdo misliš je na tretjem mestu.
Torej Kitajska ima zelo dobro strategijo, naj krvavi $$$, pač slika je jasna : United States federal budget @ Wikipedia
France Rejects Genocide Accusations Against Israel in Gaza,
To accuse the Jewish state of genocide is to cross a moral threshold
To accuse the Jewish state of genocide is to cross a moral threshold
windigo ::
Aham, zdaj ko imajo Kitajci railgun, zdaj je pa cool in super. Kek, lol.
No, tole lepo opiše tvoj doseg na področju razumevanja situacije v Aziji.
Kitajci so tam bistveno bolj prodorni od bav bav Rusov kjerkoli (nimajo pa nafte in zato niso tako samozadostni), vstopili so na afganistansko mejo, sklenili tudi vojaški sporazum s Pakistanom, dvorijo Duterteju, postrani gledajo Turke, gradijo umetne otoke in premikajo meje, pošiljajo diplomatske note ob vsakem telefonskem klicu na Tajvan, počasi gradijo drugo največjo svetovno vojaško mornarico. Railgun, če je in če deluje, je samo drobna ilustracija hitrosti, s katero se to dogaja.
Pac-Man ::
Kitajska je 4. največja proizvajalka nafte in ima največje rezerve plina v skrilavcih na svetu.
Problem so samo proizvodni stroški.
Petroleum industry in China @ Wikipedia
Shale gas in China @ Wikipedia
Problem so samo proizvodni stroški.
Petroleum industry in China @ Wikipedia
Shale gas in China @ Wikipedia
The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or
the convinced Communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and
fiction and the distinction between true and false no longer exist.
the convinced Communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and
fiction and the distinction between true and false no longer exist.
Mr.B ::
Kitajska je 4. največja proizvajalka nafte in ima največje rezerve plina v skrilavcih na svetu.
Problem so samo proizvodni stroški.
Petroleum industry in China @ Wikipedia
Shale gas in China @ Wikipedia
Se mi je zdelo, da je kitajska neto izvoznica nafte in podobnih organskih substanc, ter nizke cene teh energentov skodijo Kitajski. Nekaj novega.
France Rejects Genocide Accusations Against Israel in Gaza,
To accuse the Jewish state of genocide is to cross a moral threshold
To accuse the Jewish state of genocide is to cross a moral threshold
Smrekar1 ::
D3m ::
Jaz sem pa kar razočaran.
Nad smrekarjem.
Še vedno ni padca oz. zloma ruskega gospodarstva in vsi indexi kažejo krivuljo navzgor.
2015 je mimo nato 2016 potlej 2017 sedaj pa 2018 in še zmeraj nič.
Nad smrekarjem.
Še vedno ni padca oz. zloma ruskega gospodarstva in vsi indexi kažejo krivuljo navzgor.
2015 je mimo nato 2016 potlej 2017 sedaj pa 2018 in še zmeraj nič.
|HP EliteBook|R5 6650U|
Smrekar1 ::
Še vedno ni padca oz. zloma ruskega gospodarstva in vsi indexi kažejo krivuljo navzgor.
Jup, sploh indeks kako blizu so naslednje predsedniške 'volitve'. Znan pristop pač, pred volitvami je potrebno odpreti denarnice, da se raja slučajno ne spomni izdati države in na 'demokratičnih volitvah' obkrožiti napačnega imena.
Po 'volitvah' bodo morda čez poskusili spraviti kakšno reformo, čeprav dvomim. Putin tega ni sposoben.
Mr.B ::
Se mi je zdelo, da je kitajska neto izvoznica nafte in podobnih organskih substanc, ter nizke cene teh energentov skodijo Kitajski. Nekaj novega.
Am.
"Največja uvoznica nafte od leta 2016 dalje" je po tvoje opis velike izvoznice nafte?
Zanimivo. Prosim povej še kaj več o tem.
Lol, nepismen clovek, dogovori se s pacmanom
France Rejects Genocide Accusations Against Israel in Gaza,
To accuse the Jewish state of genocide is to cross a moral threshold
To accuse the Jewish state of genocide is to cross a moral threshold
Cervantes ::
Jaz sem pa kar razočaran.
Nad smrekarjem.
Še vedno ni padca oz. zloma ruskega gospodarstva in vsi indexi kažejo krivuljo navzgor.
2015 je mimo nato 2016 potlej 2017 sedaj pa 2018 in še zmeraj nič.
Mal se skulirej, no.
Sej bo. Še zmeri je bil.
Smrekca je ko en kitajc. On VE.
EDIT:
Ups. Ne kitajc, pacman, sori.
Zgodovina sprememb…
- spremenil: Cervantes ()
Pac-Man ::
Se mi je zdelo, da je kitajska neto izvoznica nafte in podobnih organskih substanc, ter nizke cene teh energentov skodijo Kitajski. Nekaj novega.
1 mrd Kitajcev vs. 140 mio Rusov ima nekaj malega opraviti z domačo porabo.
Plus standard je višji in si povprečni Kitajec lahko privošči več od povprečnega Rusa.
The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or
the convinced Communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and
fiction and the distinction between true and false no longer exist.
the convinced Communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and
fiction and the distinction between true and false no longer exist.
Samuel ::
Kitajci že vejo, nč skrbet.
Sicer so pa prav oni izumili smodnik.
En railgun, big deal.
A so dejansko Kitajci napisali kje, da gre sploh za railgun? Dajmo na začetku. Ker tako ali tako je po Mr B.-ju railgun brezveze. Zakaj bi se zdaj sploh kdo kaj dosti razburjal okoli tega??
If you notice this notice, you will notice that this notice is
noticably not worth noticing.
noticably not worth noticing.
Mr.B ::
Se mi je zdelo, da je kitajska neto izvoznica nafte in podobnih organskih substanc, ter nizke cene teh energentov skodijo Kitajski. Nekaj novega.
1 mrd Kitajcev vs. 140 mio Rusov ima nekaj malega opraviti z domačo porabo.
Plus standard je višji in si povprečni Kitajec lahko privošči več od povprečnega Rusa.
Kitajska ni BRUTO izvoznik naftnih derivatov.
Kitajci že vejo, nč skrbet.
Sicer so pa prav oni izumili smodnik.
En railgun, big deal.
A so dejansko Kitajci napisali kje, da gre sploh za railgun? Dajmo na začetku. Ker tako ali tako je po Mr B.-ju railgun brezveze. Zakaj bi se zdaj sploh kdo kaj dosti razburjal okoli tega??
Če je na twixicu je zagotovo res. Ti bo Pax Man poveda.
Seveda se boš pa potrudil elaborirat v kontekstu "tako je po Mr B.-ju railgun brezveze"
France Rejects Genocide Accusations Against Israel in Gaza,
To accuse the Jewish state of genocide is to cross a moral threshold
To accuse the Jewish state of genocide is to cross a moral threshold
Zgodovina sprememb…
- spremenil: Mr.B ()
Pac-Man ::
Kitajska ni BRUTO izvoznik naftnih derivatov.
Zaradi prevelike domače porabe. Podobno kot ZDA.
Rusi so prerevni in jih je premalo ter lahko zato še izvažajo.
Vseeno je Kitajska ena večjih proizvajalk nafte.
Če še vedno ne dojameš, naj ti naprej razlaga Zoolander.
The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or
the convinced Communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and
fiction and the distinction between true and false no longer exist.
the convinced Communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and
fiction and the distinction between true and false no longer exist.
Mr.B ::
Kot kaže, še ne vzrok zakaj rabijom američani multiplicirati jederske konice : of a successful test of its mid-course land-based ballistic missile interception technology
Sam pri kitajcih nikol ne veš.
Ps, kot kaže je bil MANPADS, ki je sestrelil prvega ruskija... verjetno se bo par "Verba" zgubilo v Siriji, in se preselilo v Yemen ali kam bolj vroče.
Sam pri kitajcih nikol ne veš.
Ps, kot kaže je bil MANPADS, ki je sestrelil prvega ruskija... verjetno se bo par "Verba" zgubilo v Siriji, in se preselilo v Yemen ali kam bolj vroče.
France Rejects Genocide Accusations Against Israel in Gaza,
To accuse the Jewish state of genocide is to cross a moral threshold
To accuse the Jewish state of genocide is to cross a moral threshold
Pac-Man ::
The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or
the convinced Communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and
fiction and the distinction between true and false no longer exist.
the convinced Communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and
fiction and the distinction between true and false no longer exist.
Pac-Man ::
Včerajšnji Elonov šov je precej udaril na ruski ego.
https://twitter.com/lennutrajektoor
Zdaj pa ta video:
@1:20 Russia's state TV Rossiya24 first top news was "Our response to Elon Musk" featuring snow made life size Iskander ICBM mobile launch pad carved by penal colony convicts on orders of the prison officials. Yes, this is the XXI century.
@1:45 Russia's state TV accuses Elon Musk throwing money down the drain saying $500M for Falcon Heavy launch is equal to Topol-M mobile mobile launchpad cost and essentially is pointless to send a car to space.
@2:00 Russia's state TV can't fathom why such losses like loosing 2nd stage to the sea and why it's necessary to have such financial losses.
@2:55 Russia's state TV seriously discusses possibility of Elon Musk to be a con because no proof Falcon Heavy actually can carry 63tn cargo. Tesla is a feeble 2tn. Especially this is not the first heavy lifting rocket in human history. No news!
@3:25 Roskosmos rep accuses SpaceX in having Falcon Heavy twice weaker than Saturn V (An American rocket!) and 1,5 times less capable than Soviet rocket Energiya. Not the most fantastic feat!
@4:20 Russia's space academy official accuses Elon Musk in not achieving the 63tn load as there's no need nor have he learned to fly the rocket. As Musk plans couple of launches they are significantly less than erroneously declared 63tn payload.
@4:45 Russia's state TV accuses Elon Musk on not returning safely the 2nd stage main booster intact, doubt seriously in economic feasibility of reusable boosters. Let's an expert say something to support the claim. Literally, literally in economic unfeasibility a Russian space journal editor-in-chief compare to the Shuttle program and said it doomed the program. I mean literally they can't over the Shuttle program.
@5:45 Russia's state TV literally accuses SpaceX to be run by the USA government, taking orders from them, having Pentagon as main sponsor. They claim commercial space launches are not full fledged space program at all. This is nothingburger.
@6:20 Russia's state TV openly accuses Elon Musk doing black PR on failed Falcon Heavy launch, trying among other things, push PR & sales of Tesla cars that can't manage to become profitable. Everything Elon Musk does is total & utter failure. Elon Musk just got scolded on Russia's state TV on selling his bogus flamethrowers by an marketing expert!
@6:55 Russia's state TV accused Elon Musk in running scam schemas to skim the stakeholders to save his billions trying to avoid bankruptcies of his failed enterprises which sustain losses in billions.
First time ever Russia's state TV started news program with scolding, beating, demeaning, flushing down the toilet Elon Musk with his Heavy Falcon and other enterprises to continue with second news of Putin's trip to Novosibirsk.
https://twitter.com/lennutrajektoor
Fun fact: Roskosmos official response to Q what they think of Falcon Heavy launch was Nice trick!. They regard the achievement as a circus stunt. Trampoline space adventurers.
Fun fact: Russians can't take it any more. Announced launch of Russian Heavy Lifting Rocket by 2028. Fast fellas.
BREAKING Roskomos restates their response on Falcon Heavy and insist it's a cheap trick. Eat that Elon Musk!
Top news on Rossiya 24: Why you should not celebrate Elon Musk's achievement. Top. News.
@1:20 Russia's state TV Rossiya24 first top news was "Our response to Elon Musk" featuring snow made life size Iskander ICBM mobile launch pad carved by penal colony convicts on orders of the prison officials. Yes, this is the XXI century.
@1:45 Russia's state TV accuses Elon Musk throwing money down the drain saying $500M for Falcon Heavy launch is equal to Topol-M mobile mobile launchpad cost and essentially is pointless to send a car to space.
@2:00 Russia's state TV can't fathom why such losses like loosing 2nd stage to the sea and why it's necessary to have such financial losses.
@2:55 Russia's state TV seriously discusses possibility of Elon Musk to be a con because no proof Falcon Heavy actually can carry 63tn cargo. Tesla is a feeble 2tn. Especially this is not the first heavy lifting rocket in human history. No news!
@3:25 Roskosmos rep accuses SpaceX in having Falcon Heavy twice weaker than Saturn V (An American rocket!) and 1,5 times less capable than Soviet rocket Energiya. Not the most fantastic feat!
@4:20 Russia's space academy official accuses Elon Musk in not achieving the 63tn load as there's no need nor have he learned to fly the rocket. As Musk plans couple of launches they are significantly less than erroneously declared 63tn payload.
@4:45 Russia's state TV accuses Elon Musk on not returning safely the 2nd stage main booster intact, doubt seriously in economic feasibility of reusable boosters. Let's an expert say something to support the claim. Literally, literally in economic unfeasibility a Russian space journal editor-in-chief compare to the Shuttle program and said it doomed the program. I mean literally they can't over the Shuttle program.
@5:45 Russia's state TV literally accuses SpaceX to be run by the USA government, taking orders from them, having Pentagon as main sponsor. They claim commercial space launches are not full fledged space program at all. This is nothingburger.
@6:20 Russia's state TV openly accuses Elon Musk doing black PR on failed Falcon Heavy launch, trying among other things, push PR & sales of Tesla cars that can't manage to become profitable. Everything Elon Musk does is total & utter failure. Elon Musk just got scolded on Russia's state TV on selling his bogus flamethrowers by an marketing expert!
@6:55 Russia's state TV accused Elon Musk in running scam schemas to skim the stakeholders to save his billions trying to avoid bankruptcies of his failed enterprises which sustain losses in billions.
First time ever Russia's state TV started news program with scolding, beating, demeaning, flushing down the toilet Elon Musk with his Heavy Falcon and other enterprises to continue with second news of Putin's trip to Novosibirsk.
The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or
the convinced Communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and
fiction and the distinction between true and false no longer exist.
the convinced Communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and
fiction and the distinction between true and false no longer exist.
Zgodovina sprememb…
- spremenilo: Pac-Man ()
Cervantes ::
No ja.
Americanos bojo na ISS še naprej potovali z muzejskimi Sojuzi in lansirali rakete z ruskimi motorji.
Kaj pravi tvoj Atlantic Council o tem?
Americanos bojo na ISS še naprej potovali z muzejskimi Sojuzi in lansirali rakete z ruskimi motorji.
Kaj pravi tvoj Atlantic Council o tem?
Pac-Man ::
Ne več dolgo.
The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or
the convinced Communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and
fiction and the distinction between true and false no longer exist.
the convinced Communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and
fiction and the distinction between true and false no longer exist.
Samuel ::
No ja.
Americanos bojo na ISS še naprej potovali z muzejskimi Sojuzi in lansirali rakete z ruskimi motorji.
Kaj pravi tvoj Atlantic Council o tem?
SpaceX ne uporablja ruskih motorjev.
If you notice this notice, you will notice that this notice is
noticably not worth noticing.
noticably not worth noticing.
Cervantes ::
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