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Strmoglavil malezijski 777 v Ukrajini

Strmoglavil malezijski 777 v Ukrajini

Temo vidijo: vsi
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D3m ::

Bom raje GoT gledal.
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s1m0n ::

Pac-Man je izjavil:

Čez 1 uro bo na BBCju tole:

http://www.standard.co.uk/stayingin/tvf...

Kako usposobit iPlayer naj ugotovi pa vsak sam ;)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/live/bbctwo


A niso večino VPNjev blokirali ? Že par mesecev nazaj mi ni uspelo najt nobenega proxy-a :)

Pac-Man ::

Hola šiba :)

s1m0n ::

Mi je žal ne gre namestit na nobenem brskalniku (connection error) :)

Pac-Man ::

Nisi ravno veliko zamudil, problematike so se lotili preveč v rokavičkah.

Precej očitno so avtorji družboslovci, pri argumentaciji pa jim je neslo samo do "postavimo osebo pred kamero in ji pustimo, da pove svoje." Tako da je ostalo pri blabla vs. blabla.

Največji "dosežek" so posnetki norcev z BBCjevim logotipom zgoraj levo, ki bodo v bližnji prihodnosti izrezani in lepljeni po vseh mogočih portalih. Ruski propagandisti zagotovo nazdravljajo.

So pa pri Bellingcat izdali novo poročilo o Buku 332. Primerjali so celo električne povezave na lanserju :)

https://www.bellingcat.com/news/uk-and-...

The full report gives details on the process in determining that these three TELARs were the only possible candidates for identification. After comparing the seven unique features, Buk 332 was the only TELAR that had even one of these features in common with Buk 3×2 from materials recorded in Russia in June 2014 and eastern Ukraine on July 17 and 18, 2014. The seven examined features were: side skirt profile, wheel type (combination of hollow wheels and spoke wheels), dent in the left side panel, arrangement of cable connections to the missile erector, white mark on both side skirts, font and exact spacing of digits, and the shape and size of oil/soot deposits by exhaust

The full report, downloadable here, provides a detailed analysis of each of these seven features. This summary will compare a few of the most conclusive features.

...

Another identifier for identifying the correct Buk is by studying the cable connections to the missile erector on the revolving turret. There are four cables on both the left and right side leading to the missile erector, providing us with eight cables to compare.



After studying a number of Buks, it becomes clear that there are different arrangements and lengths to the cables. In the following two figures, the cable connections of Buk 3×2 is compared to the ones of Buks 312, 322, and 332.



Here, on the right side, only Buk 332 shows a similarity to the cable arrangement of Buk 3×2. The blue-marked cable four is connected to the top plug on the turret chassis. Buk 312 and 322 show a different cabling, and cable four is connected to the bottom plug. Also, Buk 312, 322 and 332 show a distinct shape of the cabling, and only the shape of Buk 332 resembles that of the cabling of 3×2.



The comparison on the left side allows only a partial comparison. It is not possible to see the plugs on the turret chassis. However, Buk 332 shows the same distinct spread of the cabling in the middle that is also visible on 3×2. Nothing comparable is visible on 312 or 322.

Pac-Man ::

Še Christo Grozev

https://twitter.com/christogrozev

Sad...@BBC present Billy Six as "independent journalist"... No mention in 2013 he thanked Russia for saving his life




"There is said to be satellite photos showing bottles of beer around the BUK (that Ukrainians shot) < < senility is always said...

Again. @BBC give extensive airtime to "CIA analyst Ray McGovern", no mention he also says 9/11 was "an inside job."


Sorry, @BBC, you are incredibly irresponsible.

You can't give equal airtime to complete nutcases & valid reasoning, and then hope your subtle conclusions will be noticed by audiences.

@BBC: "bitter civil war", "Ukraine is caught in a proxy war between Russia and the West". wtf??

Let's recapitulate. We had witness seeing physically impossible dogfight at 10km, & witness w balistically precise description of BUK launch


http://www.mercurynews.com/ci_22728783/...

A German freelance journalist illegally inside Syria wondered why passing motorists kept making hand gestures. Moments later he realized why. They were trying to warn him of Syrian soldiers just over the crest of a hill.

By then it was too late. Billy Six was soon lying face down in the mud, surrounded by a dozen Syrian army soldiers. Thus began a 12-week saga that ended Tuesday, when he was handed over to Russian diplomats in Damascus who had helped secure his release.

...

He said he was handcuffed and driven to a military camp. From there he was taken to a prison in the central province of Hama, where he was held for 12 days. During interrogations, he was blindfolded and several times guards threatened to beat him.

Six said he heard other detainees being tortured at night and later saw lots of blood on the floors of the prison's hallways. In the end, the journalist said, his German passport was probably what saved him from such abuse.

Six, who was writing for a conservative German weekly Junge Freiheit, said he was mostly held in solitary confinement with no word to his family or his employer that he was still alive. He said his first sign of hope came when two Syrian soldiers offered him tea.

Zgodovina sprememb…

  • spremenilo: Pac-Man ()

AC_DC ::

s1m0n je izjavil:

Pac-Man je izjavil:

Čez 1 uro bo na BBCju tole:

http://www.standard.co.uk/stayingin/tvf...

Kako usposobit iPlayer naj ugotovi pa vsak sam ;)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/live/bbctwo


A niso večino VPNjev blokirali ? Že par mesecev nazaj mi ni uspelo najt nobenega proxy-a :)

https://www.reddit.com/r/opensource/com...
Filtriraj AY (ali BA stolpec, če bi rad "testiral").

Npr ra4wvpn ponuja 1 mesečni paket za $2.50.

Zgodovina sprememb…

  • spremenilo: AC_DC ()

Pac-Man ::

Tole je po objavi zadnjega poročila, ki ima tudi ruski prevod.

https://twitter.com/bellingcat

Bellingcat just passed 100,000 page views in one day for the first time.

Interesting to note 40% of our web traffic yesterday came from Russia, obviously a big interest in our work there.

All time result for the city where Bellingcat most read is..... Moscow



Režim ni tako zelo trdno v sedlu, kot se dela ;)

Pac-Man ::

Da si nekam vržem, če bom spet iskal

Putin 17. julija, po vrnitvi iz J. Amerike. Praktično v času sestrelitve.



Prva izjava po dogodku, v noči iz 17. na 18. julij




Precej dolgih obrazov v kabinetu

Pac-Man ::

Našel se je nov video konvoja z bukom s 17. julija 2014 dopoldne.



https://www.bellingcat.com/news/2016/05...

On May 3rd 2016, a new video of what appears to be the July 17th 2014 Buk convoy was uploaded to YouTube, and was on May 11th discovered by Twitter users @amishjihadi and @loondale. In the video, there are several details visible which seem to indicate this is the same Buk TELAR that has been recorded moving towards the suspected Buk missile launch site, thus associating it with the downing of MH17.

...

In the video at 0:47, the same white truck from earlier Buk transport videos can be seen. The truck has the Buk TELAR loaded on the back, and there appear to be four missiles mounted, with a camouflage netting covering them.



An interesting detail that provides further validity to the link to the previous videos are the escort vehicles that can be seen before and after the truck. Bellingcat has previously reported about the vehicles, and we can direct matches: there is a Toyota RAV4 in front of the truck, with a UAZ-469AZ and VW Transporter following it.



The description in the video claims the location to be Makiivka, east of Donetsk. There are details visible in the video which make geolocation of this video possible.

...

More detailed geolocations have been completed by other open source researchers, including Anton Pavlushko and @DajeyPetros (also known as Putin@War/Ukraine@War). The geolocations reveal that the convoy is headed eastward in southern Makiivka.



The time of the video can be confirmed to be in mid-July 2014 as well. As pointed out by Twitter user @WowihaY, the fuel prices in the video match that of a page archived on July 18, 2014 on the webpage of the fuel station in the video.

The visible shadows indicate that the video was taken in the late morning, which is in line with the anticipated time frame of the transport. The exact time of the video has yet to be determined.

Pac-Man ::

https://twitter.com/DajeyPetros/status/...

Geolocation of new #MH17 BUK video: 48° 1'4.42"N 37°59'2.55"E

It means #MH17 BUK and loader did not exactly take expected route from Donetsk to Snizhne.

This also explains why the 'Bellingcat' satellite image did not capture the BUK + loader: it was not on that route anyways.

Estimated/calculated time of new #MH17 BUK video with suncalc is 11:10 local time.

PREDICTION: since the time the '@Bellingcat satellite image' was taken, was at 11:08, the loader almost certainly can be seen south of it.

Govora je o satelitskem posnetku, ki ga je pred časom croudfoundal Bellingcat. Njihov odgovor:

@DajeyPetros We'll get the rest of the image.

Saj ne, da bo kaj dosti več jasno, bo pa zanimivo poslušat izgovore. Vidnih je tudi nekaj oblačkov, upam da ne pokvarijo vsega.

Pac-Man ::

Hop cifizelj, Stratfor se je izprsil.

https://www.stratfor.com/analysis/exami...

In early May, new video footage of unknown origins was released, appearing to place the Buk system in question near separatist-controlled Donetsk on July 17, 2014, just hours before the airliner was shot down.

Building on this new information, AllSource Analysis — Stratfor's satellite imagery partner — was able to locate images that confirm the exact time and location of the air defense system on the day of the crash. The imagery shows the air defense system, mounted atop a transloader, being transported east through the Donetsk town of Makiivka. The images were taken approximately five hours before Flight MH17 was shot down from a location near the town of Snizhne, about 40 kilometers (25 miles) away.

Pac-Man ::

Sem se šel malo Picassa.



zelena črta: pot avta z dashcamom
rdeča črta: pot konvoja z bukom
oranžen krog: mesto srečanja
moder krog: lokacija buka na satelitskem posnetku

Kroga sta manj kot 500 m narazen, satelit je šel čez v praktično istem trenutku. Zagotovo se da najt tudi avto, iz katerega je narejen video.

7982884e ::

žal je preteklo toliko vode, da odgovorni v rusiji ne bodo nikdar odgovarjali. ruska propaganda je v sledečih mesecih po sestrelitvi bila zadosti uspešna, da je rusofilska javnost ostala zaverovana v svoje.

Pac-Man ::

Ruski trolčki bodo peli, kakor bo RT dirigiral, uradna pozicija Moskve je pa zakoličena od 21. junija, ko je imelo obrambno ministrstvo tiskovno konferenco akcijsko prodajo laži. Vsaj do kake konkretne menjave v Kremlju.

Po vsem zanikanju ne gre ugotoviti, da jim je en buk s posadko pravzaprav res ušel čez mejo. Ups. :) Bolj zanimivo je v katero smer bodo šli zaključki kriminalistične preiskave, ki naj bi se končala naslednji mesec. Morda jo bo nov video malo podaljšal, k sami zgodbi pa doda samo bolj ovinkasto pot do mesta izstrelitve.

Ali bodo šli direktno na verzijo ruskega buka z rusko posadko in z odgovornostjo poveljniške strukture obrambnih sil RF, ali preko ovinka s separatisti. Malo problematično je obtožit vojsko jedrske sile za umor skoraj 300 ljudi, ta pa odgovornost vztrajno zanika.

Edina stvar, ki so jo do sedaj dali od sebe, kaže, da imajo cohones in bodo šli na ostro.

@2:30

D3m ::

Se bodo že zmenili z Ukrajinci glede odškodnine.
|HP EliteBook|R5 6650U|

Zgodovina sprememb…

  • spremenil: D3m ()

Šimpanz ::

Američani so tudi sklatili Iransko potniško letalo pa se nobenemu ni nič zgodilo. Če tam ni bilo nobenih posledic, jih tudi tukaj ne bo.

Martin Krpan ::

Sklatili so ga res , nobenemu se res ni nič zgodilo , so pa vsaj priznali.
Vsaj to!

D3m ::

Priznali so, ko so ugotovili zmoto in, da take stvari ne bodo mogli prikriti.
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AC_DC ::

Poveljnik raketne križarke USS Vincennes je bil pohvaljen / dobil medaljo.

Uboga ZDA mornarica / slepi radaristi, ki ne ločijo med airbusom A300 in f-14.

Combat Action Ribbon @ Wikipedia
The Combat Action Ribbon is a service ribbon that is awarded by the United States Navy, United States Marine Corps, and United States Coast Guard for satisfactory performance under enemy fire in ground and surface/maritime combat.



Smetana na torti:
The incident took place in Iranian airspace, over Iran's territorial waters in the Persian Gulf, and on the flight's usual flight path.



Si predstavljate kakšen bi bil odziv ZDA, če bi kaj podobnega uspelo narediti Rusom pred Florido ?

Zgodovina sprememb…

  • spremenilo: AC_DC ()

Martin Krpan ::

D3m je izjavil:

Priznali so, ko so ugotovili zmoto in, da take stvari ne bodo mogli prikriti.


In kdaj bodo priznali rusi ?

D3m ::

A so obtožili Ruse?
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mtosev ::

Martin Krpan je izjavil:

Sklatili so ga res , nobenemu se res ni nič zgodilo , so pa vsaj priznali.
Vsaj to!
so tudi plačali odškodnito družinam. Američani ko zajebejo vsaj priznajo. So tudi priznali ko so neki njihovi vojaki v vietnamu pobijali civiliste. Tisti vojak kateri jih je prijavil je pol dobil neko odlikovanje
Core i9 10900X, ASUS Prime X299 Edition 30, 32GB 4x8 3600Mhz G.skill, CM H500M,
ASUS ROG Strix RTX 2080 Super, Samsung 970 PRO, UltraSharp UP3017, Win 11 Pro
moj oče darko 1960-2016, moj labradorec max 2002-2013

Zgodovina sprememb…

  • spremenil: mtosev ()

D3m ::

Priznali so, ker so jih dobili. Drugače ne bi.

Manj naivnosti prosim.
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mtosev ::

Riiight.
Core i9 10900X, ASUS Prime X299 Edition 30, 32GB 4x8 3600Mhz G.skill, CM H500M,
ASUS ROG Strix RTX 2080 Super, Samsung 970 PRO, UltraSharp UP3017, Win 11 Pro
moj oče darko 1960-2016, moj labradorec max 2002-2013

D3m ::

Vem. Zate so biser človeštva.
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mtosev ::

D3m je izjavil:

Vem. Zate so biser človeštva.

Kdo? Američani? Nič ekstra niso, so pa boljši kot Putin in njegove rusije
Core i9 10900X, ASUS Prime X299 Edition 30, 32GB 4x8 3600Mhz G.skill, CM H500M,
ASUS ROG Strix RTX 2080 Super, Samsung 970 PRO, UltraSharp UP3017, Win 11 Pro
moj oče darko 1960-2016, moj labradorec max 2002-2013

Zgodovina sprememb…

  • spremenil: mtosev ()

Martin Krpan ::

D3m je izjavil:

Priznali so, ker so jih dobili. Drugače ne bi.

Manj naivnosti prosim.


Tudi ruse smo dobili , pa še vedno ne priznajo in glumijo gljivo.;(

D3m ::

Vse smo dobili. Še naše pa še kar glumijo. >:D

Življenje je kurba.
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Zgodovina sprememb…

  • spremenil: D3m ()

7tom1ja ::

Martin Krpan je izjavil:

Sklatili so ga res , nobenemu se res ni nič zgodilo , so pa vsaj priznali.
Vsaj to!


to pa sploh ni res, da se jim ni nič zgodilo;

pogumni možje na USS Vincennes so vsi dobili nagrade "combat-action ribbons"
Na nas leži naloga, da naprej razvijamo našo samoupravno socialistično družbo,
da jo gradimo na revolucionarnih temeljih, temeljih marksizma.
Brigada AVNOJ 77;Komisar Ivan Janša

Smrekar1 ::

7tom1ja je izjavil:


pogumni možje na USS Vincennes so vsi dobili nagrade "combat-action ribbons"


Jup, ampak ker so nekaj mesecev uspešno patrluljirali v sovražnih vodah in odbili več napadov iranskih torpednih čolnov in ne ker so sestrelili Airbusa.

To ti je verjetno ušlo. Menda imajo v Sanolaborju pripomočke, ki v takih primerih koristijo.

D3m je izjavil:

Priznali so, ker so jih dobili. Drugače ne bi.

Manj naivnosti prosim.


Imaš link do kakšnega primera, ki bi to potrdil? :)

Zgodovina sprememb…

  • spremenil: Smrekar1 ()

SimplyMiha ::

Do zdaj še nič dokončnega od preiskave, čeprav je že minilo več kot dovolj časa. Mogoče so pikolovsko natančni?

Ma ja, so prezaposleni z metanjem polen pod noge drugih preiskovalcev (pa čeprav zasebnih):
German police raided house of private detective who paid reward for MH17 information

D3m ::

Da te ne bo Pac-man polajal.
|HP EliteBook|R5 6650U|

Smrekar1 ::

SimplyMiha je izjavil:

Do zdaj še nič dokončnega od preiskave, čeprav je že minilo več kot dovolj časa. Mogoče so pikolovsko natančni?


Em, že ene pol leta nazaj je prišlo ven poročilo, da ga je sestrelila raketa tipa Buk, ki jo uporablja izključno Rusija. V tej točki je samo Kremelj tisti, ki nam lahko postreže z dokončnimi odgovori: imeni in priimki odgovornih.

No, za enega ti lahko povem: Vladimir Vladimirovič Putler.

D3m ::

Kdo je Putler?
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Smrekar1 ::

D3m je izjavil:

Kdo je Putler?


Kremeljski poglavar.

D3m ::

Na sliki je Putin.

Verjetno si mislil tega Putler

https://vimeo.com/user26876313
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Starodavni ::

Nope, mišljeno je kot kombinacija Putin in Hitler - Putler

Zaradi tega

 Hitler in Putin

Hitler in Putin



Diktator je pač diktator in vzorci so identični pri vseh.

Zgodovina sprememb…

AC_DC ::

Ja, pod zapitim Jelcinom je bilo bolje.

Starodavni ::

Tako kot zdaj pod norim putinom ni nič bolje.
naraščajoča brezposelnost
inflacija
povečano št. ljudi pod pragom revščine
drage osnovne dobrine

Putin je bil uspešen sam zaradi tega, ker je imel v času mandatov visoke cene nafte, brez tega bi bilo samo nadaljevanje jelcinove polomije. Za nameček pa je ta Putin prekanaliziral na škodo Rusije več milijard $ premoženja in financ.

Pol ne veš kaj je bolje Putin ali Jelcin, ali pa je oboje ista stvar. No vsaj eno vem, Jelcin ni grozil drugim državam in se vtikoval v njihove odnose. Putin pa se vtikuje po nepotrebnem.

D3m ::

Sem že mislil, da opisuješ drugo državo in ne Rusijo, ki ji začuda sankicije ne povzročajo resnih preglavic.

@smrekar1

Ena napaka je v sliki, Donbas si niso prisvojili tako, da povezave med Adolfom ni.
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mtosev ::

AC_DC je izjavil:

Ja, pod zapitim Jelcinom je bilo bolje.

Ja tipo se ga je napil in pol ni imel čudaških idej kot Putin. Slabo, da Putin tud ni pijanček.:))
Core i9 10900X, ASUS Prime X299 Edition 30, 32GB 4x8 3600Mhz G.skill, CM H500M,
ASUS ROG Strix RTX 2080 Super, Samsung 970 PRO, UltraSharp UP3017, Win 11 Pro
moj oče darko 1960-2016, moj labradorec max 2002-2013

7982884e ::

SimplyMiha je izjavil:

Do zdaj še nič dokončnega od preiskave, čeprav je že minilo več kot dovolj časa. Mogoče so pikolovsko natančni?

Ma ja, so prezaposleni z metanjem polen pod noge drugih preiskovalcev (pa čeprav zasebnih):
German police raided house of private detective who paid reward for MH17 information

kaj je bilo, je jasno od prvega dne in potem v naslednjih tednih in mesecih samo še bolj; edini reveži, ki jim ni jasno, so najbolj zagrizeni prokremeljski troli.

Smrekar1 ::

D3m je izjavil:



Ena napaka je v sliki, Donbas si niso prisvojili tako, da povezave med Adolfom ni.


Isto je kot Splošna Vlada.

General Government @ Wikipedia

D3m ::

Ne ni, ker zdaj primerjaš hruške in jabolka.
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Pac-Man ::

D3m je izjavil:

Ena napaka je v sliki, Donbas si niso prisvojili tako, da povezave med Adolfom ni.


Infografika ne omenja prisvojitve Donbasa, ampak Krim in to

Anschluss @ Wikipedia

In addition, the German ministry of propaganda issued press reports that riots had broken out in Austria and that large parts of the Austrian population were calling for German troops to restore order. Schuschnigg immediately responded that reports of riots were false

...

Schuschnigg desperately sought support for Austrian independence in the hours following the ultimatum. Realizing that neither France nor Britain was willing to offer assistance, he resigned as chancellor that evening. In the radio broadcast in which he announced his resignation, he argued that he accepted the changes and allowed the Nazis to take over the government 'to avoid the shedding of fraternal blood [Bruderblut]'. Seyss-Inquart was appointed chancellor, and sent a predrafted telegram requesting that German troops enter Austria to help restore order.

...

On the morning of 12 March, the 8th Army of the German Wehrmacht crossed the border into Austria. The troops were greeted by cheering Austrians with Nazi salutes, Nazi flags, and flowers. For the Wehrmacht, the invasion was the first big test of its machinery. Although the invading forces were badly organized and coordination among the units was poor, it mattered little because the Austrian government had ordered the Austrian Bundesheer not to resist.

...

The seizure of Austria demonstrated once again Hitler's aggressive territorial ambitions, and, once again, the failure of the British and the French to take action against him for violating the Versailles Treaty. Their lack of will emboldened him toward further aggression.

...

Hitler's forces suppressed all opposition. Before the first German soldier crossed the border, Heinrich Himmler and a few SS officers landed in Vienna to arrest prominent representatives of the First Republic, such as Richard Schmitz, Leopold Figl, Friedrich Hillegeist, and Franz Olah. During the few weeks between the Anschluss and the plebiscite, authorities rounded up Social Democrats, Communists, and other potential political dissenters, as well as Jews, and imprisoned them or sent them to concentration camps. Within a few days of 12 March, 70,000 people had been arrested. The disused northwest railway station in Vienna was converted into a makeshift concentration camp.[38][citation needed] The plebiscite was subject to large-scale propaganda and to the abrogation of the voting rights of around 400,000 people (nearly 10% of the eligible voting population), mainly former members of left-wing parties and Jews.

...

The Anschluss was given immediate effect by legislative act on 13 March, subject to ratification by a plebiscite. Austria became the province of Ostmark, and Seyss-Inquart was appointed governor. The plebiscite was held on 10 April and officially recorded a support of 99.7% of the voters.



Sem zmešan, ali so res očitne podobnosti?

D3m ::

Ampak primerjave ni, kot je smrečica pravil.

Donbas ni Sudetenland.
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Smrekar1 ::

D3m je izjavil:


Donbas ni Sudetenland.


To je res. Donbas leži vzhodneje in za razliko od Sudetije je konflikt v celoti sproduciran v Kremlju. Sudetski nemci so si namreč večvidel dejansko želeli živeti v nacistični Nemčiji, medtem ko v Donbasu ni ravno jasno ali bi raje živeli v fašistični Rusiji ali ne.

SimplyMiha ::

Razlika je v tem, da v Donbasu nočejo živeti v fašistični Ukrajini. Seveda je to iz udobnega domačega naslonjača težko uvideti.

Smrekar1 ::

SimplyMiha je izjavil:

Razlika je v tem, da v Donbasu nočejo živeti v fašistični Ukrajini.


Fašistična Ukrajina ne obstaja. Nekoč je obstajala kot nesamostojen del fašistične velesile, potem pa je SZ razpadla in so prevzeli nekoliko bolj moderen sistem vladanja.
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