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strani: 1 2 »

smash ::

recimo da delaš na aplikaciji, ki deluje v windows sistemu, ki je monopolen na tržišču

tvoja aplikacija je 100x boljša in ima 100x več featurjev kot od microsofta, ki ponuja svojo aplikacijo in tvoji noče omogočit delovanje, čeprav je tvoja 100x boljša

vidiš problem?

po tvojem bi moral poleg svoje aplikacije ponudit tudi svoj sistem?

darkolord ::

"Onemogoča" in "noče omogočit" je nekaj čisto drugega.

Ampak nima veze kako dobra je tvoja aplikacija - če je slaba in rabi patchan kernel za delovanje, bi eni lahko rekli "Ej grdi Microsoft! Dej mi omogoči da patcham kernel ker drugače moja aplikacija ne bo delala!" in da jim mečejo polena pod noge.
spamtrap@hokej.si
spamtrap@gettymobile.si

Zgodovina sprememb…

  • spremenilo: darkolord ()

PaX_MaN ::

"Ej grdi Microsoft! Dej mi omogoči da patcham kernel ker drugače moja aplikacija ne bo delala!"

Uh, to je MS na veliko delal:

The testers on the Windows team were going through various popular applications, testing them to make sure they worked OK, but SimCity kept crashing. They reported this to the Windows developers, who disassembled SimCity, stepped through it in a debugger, found the bug, and added special code that checked if SimCity was running, and if it did, ran the memory allocator in a special mode in which you could still use memory after freeing it.



This was not an unusual case. The Windows testing team is huge and one of their most important responsibilities is guaranteeing that everyone can safely upgrade their operating system, no matter what applications they have installed, and those applications will continue to run, even if those applications do bad things or use undocumented functions or rely on buggy behavior that happens to be buggy in Windows n but is no longer buggy in Windows n+1. In fact if you poke around in the AppCompatibility section of your registry you'll see a whole list of applications that Windows treats specially, emulating various old bugs and quirky behaviors so they'll continue to work.
Neresno trolanje JS @ https://github.com/paxman/ZDIJZovanje
Za tenorista me imajo: BSi, Policija, MF.
Kar pogreje me pri srcu!

Zgodovina sprememb…

  • spremenilo: PaX_MaN ()

Icematxyz ::

PaX_MaN je izjavil:

Icematxyz je izjavil:

Tukaj imaš:

Nočem komentarjev sodbe, hočem komentarje pravne podlage za to sodbo.
(Tko k maš "Komentar Slovenske ustave" pa "Kazenski zakonik s komentarjem")


139 In that regard, it should be recalled that, in order for the refusal by an undertaking which owns a copyright to give access to a product or service indispensable for carrying on a particular business to be regarded as abuse, it is sufficient that three cumulative conditions be satisfied, namely that that refusal is preventing the emergence of a new product for which there is a potential consumer demand, that it is unjustified and that it is such as to exclude any competition on a secondary market (Case C‑418/01 IMS Health [2004] ECR I‑5039, paragraph 38).

140 In this case, it has been found that, since the three cumulative conditions mentioned in paragraph 139 above were satisfied, Microsoft’s refusal to give access to the interoperability information and to authorise its use was abusive (see, to that effect, Microsoft v Commission, paragraph 18 above, paragraphs 711 and 712)....

142 Moreover, allowing Microsoft to charge remuneration rates reflecting the value resulting from the mere ability to interoperate with Microsoft’s operating systems – in other words the strategic value stemming from Microsoft’s power in the client PC operating systems market or the work group server operating systems market – would in effect allow it to transform the benefits of the abuse into remuneration for the grant of licences. Recognition of such a right would by definition run counter to the objective stated in recital 1003 to the 2004 decision, which is to allow viable competition with Microsoft’s work group server operating system, since Microsoft would be in a position to charge all potential competitors prohibitive rates of remuneration. As is stated in recitals 106 and 107 to the contested decision, such rates thus could not be regarded as reasonable for the purposes of recital 1008(ii) and Article 5(a) of the 2004 decision.


Menim, da se to kar dobro bere in zadostuje za potek nadaljnje razprave. Se pravi da je nivo dovolj visok in ne iz zadnjice potegnjen.

In tudi podoben primer sem podal, kar Microsoft očita podjetju Google:

Microsoft has filed an antitrust lawsuit against Google in the European Union, claiming that the search giant is stifling competition.

...accuses the search giant of taking measures to push out Microsoft and other competitors in the European market...

...“Google has done much to advance its laudable mission to ‘organize the world’s information,’” writes Smith, “but we’re concerned by a broadening pattern of conduct aimed at stopping anyone else from creating a competitive alternative.”...

...According to Microsoft, Google’s unwillingness to let the Microsoft’s Bing search engine (and Yahoo! search, which is powered by Bing) fully index Google-owned sites like YouTube prevents Bing from offering fully informed searches to its users...

...Also, Microsoft says Google blocks its Windows Phone mobile operating system from accessing vast amounts of metadata associated with YouTube videos. “We just need permission to access YouTube in the way that other phones already do, permission Google has refused to provide,” writes Smith...

...Lastly, Microsoft says Google’s ad contracts stifle competition by preventing companies that use Google’s ad platform from using third-party software that compares ad pricing between various companies and enable them to easily switch to another ad service...


Iz česar se že da razbrati, kakšna točno je pravna podlaga, ki ureja to področje.

To si nekajkrat preberi:

139 In that regard, it should be recalled that, in order for the refusal by an undertaking which owns a copyright to give access to a product or service indispensable for carrying on a particular business to be regarded as abuse, it is sufficient that three cumulative conditions be satisfied, namely that that refusal is preventing the emergence of a new product for which there is a potential consumer demand, that it is unjustified and that it is such as to exclude any competition on a secondary market (Case C‑418/01 IMS Health [2004] ECR I‑5039, paragraph 38)


In boš verjetno že razumel, če je to tvoj namen, če pa ni pa ovrži to razsodbo s pravno podlago in komentarji, ki torej to konkretno razsodbo izpodbijajo!

Zgodovina sprememb…

darkolord ::

PaX_MaN> Uh, to je MS na veliko delal

Ja, ampak ker so to sami želeli...
spamtrap@hokej.si
spamtrap@gettymobile.si

PaX_MaN ::

In boš verjetno že razumel, če je to tvoj namen, če pa ni pa ovrži to razsodbo s pravno podlago in komentarji, ki torej to konkretno razsodbo izpodbijajo!

A js to zidu govorim, al' kaj?
Spet si prlimal tisto, česar jaz _NE IŠČEM_.
Jaz iščem rationale (=komentarje) na paragrafe po katerih so MSju zacolal evrske v EU zakonodaji, ki je bila sprejeta pred žnj leti, in ki govori o tem "zagotavljanju interoperabilnosti".
Sklicevanje sodbe na sodbo iz sodbe,
Case C-418/01 IMS Health [2004] ECR I-5039, paragraph 38
,
to ni.
Neresno trolanje JS @ https://github.com/paxman/ZDIJZovanje
Za tenorista me imajo: BSi, Policija, MF.
Kar pogreje me pri srcu!

Icematxyz ::

A js to zidu govorim, al' kaj?


Ne iz zadnjice govoriš.

PaX_MaN ::

Ja, če ne znajo utemeljit zakaj je "ta pa ta člen tega in tega zakona tak in tak" pol ... ja, lenobe so si uredile dobro plačane službe, da lahko govorijo iz riti.
Pa fikuse. Ne pozabit fikusov!
Neresno trolanje JS @ https://github.com/paxman/ZDIJZovanje
Za tenorista me imajo: BSi, Policija, MF.
Kar pogreje me pri srcu!

Icematxyz ::

PaX_MaN je izjavil:

Ja, če ne znajo utemeljit zakaj je "ta pa ta člen tega in tega zakona tak in tak" pol ... ja, lenobe so si uredile dobro plačane službe, da lahko govorijo iz riti.
Pa fikuse. Ne pozabit fikusov!


Kdo to sploh pravi, da ne znajo utemeljiti? Saj del, ki sem ti ga podal in menim, da za formske razprave in dovolj visok nivo zadostuje je načeloma utemeljitev sodbe in že iz njega je drugače tudi razvidna ustrezna podlaga? Drugače pa:

Adam Smith

Smith is widely cited as the father of modern economics and capitalism and is still among the most influential thinkers in the field of economics today.


Jih je na to opozoril in za to ne čudi, da se je skladno s začetkom (ekonomskega) združevanja (EU) pojavila tudi potreba po ustreznem standardiziranem, združljivem in transparentnem ogrodju za regulacijo na tem področju. Zakonodaja torej, katere temeljna naloga je med drugim regulacija monopolov in preprečevanje zlorabe monopolnega položaja na tržišču na način, ki omejujejo konkurenco v zasebnem sektorju in se s tem proizvaja slabši rezultat za potrošnika in družbo. Nenazadnje potrebo trga po takšni regulaciji poznamo že vsaj iz rimskih časov naprej, oziroma pred tem so verjetno takšne zlorabe na tržišču urejali bolj na osnovni ravni. Konkretna podlaga za omenjen primer torej sega že v leto 1964, torej, ko je Bill Gates upihnil 9 svečko.

Tukaj (PDF) si pa recimo lahko v začetku dokumenta podrobno prebereš razlago, kako zaščita intelektualne lastnine in zakonodaja na tem področju in regulacija škodljivih praks podjetij s prevladujočim položajem na tržišču nista izključujoča pojma, če slučajno živiš pod takšnim vtisom, ampak gre za za komplementarno zakonodajo.

PaX_MaN ::

Saj del, ki sem ti ga podal in menim, da za formske razprave in dovolj visok nivo zadostuje je načeloma utemeljitev sodbe in že iz njega je drugače tudi razvidna ustrezna podlaga?

Lej, jst ne rabm mnenj naključnega Mr. Smitha, pa sodba iz sodbe glej sodbo iz sodbe, jst rabm pogledat kolkrat so v zakonu/direktivi/resoluciji rekl za to in to sankcijo "tkole more bit, ker smo mi rekl da je bad!" - da lahko štolčke grejejo , ane. Pa gojijo fikuse! - v originalnem (predlogu) zakona/direktive/resolucije teh velemož v EP/EK. Tko k maš pr ns v vsakmu predolug zakona zakaj to, zakaj ono zakaj tretje in ne tko.
Neresno trolanje JS @ https://github.com/paxman/ZDIJZovanje
Za tenorista me imajo: BSi, Policija, MF.
Kar pogreje me pri srcu!

Icematxyz ::

jst rabm pogledat kolkrat so v zakonu/direktivi/resoluciji rekl za to in to sankcijo "tkole more bit, ker smo mi rekl da je bad!"


Tukaj lahko verjetno prešteješ točno število in najdeš ustrezne podatke, ki te zanimajo:

http://ec.europa.eu/competition/elojade...

v originalnem (predlogu) zakona/direktive/resolucije teh velemož v EP/EK. Tko k maš pr ns v vsakmu predolug zakona zakaj to, zakaj ono zakaj tretje in ne tko.


Tukaj pa najdeš podlago:

http://ec.europa.eu/competition/antitru...

PaX_MaN ::

Tukaj pa najdeš podlago:

http://ec.europa.eu/competition/antitru...

Končno.
Neresno trolanje JS @ https://github.com/paxman/ZDIJZovanje
Za tenorista me imajo: BSi, Policija, MF.
Kar pogreje me pri srcu!

Icematxyz ::

PaX_MaN je izjavil:

Tukaj pa najdeš podlago:

http://ec.europa.eu/competition/antitru...

Končno.


Po vzoru in zahtevah prejšnje teme in na tej podlagi:

http://patentattorneysalary.org/1/1/sal...

High 82k : Day's 365 x Day's Work 2 = 449,31E

Možna plačila preko TRR ali če se izkoristi bonus in se v naslednji temi sprejme neka osnovna predpostavka, da nek organ EU, ki odloča o nekih pomembnih zadevah verjetno da ima za to tudi pravno in ne iz zadnjice potegnjeno podlago in da verjetno tožena stranka ne bi pred temi organi nastopala tudi kot tožnik, če temu ne bi bilo tako in da se načeloma to ne rabi dokazovati, ampak se lahko predvideva, da je temu tako?

PaX_MaN ::

Možna plačila preko TRR ali če se izkoristi bonus in se v naslednji temi sprejme neka osnovna predpostavka, da nek organ EU, ki odloča o nekih pomembnih zadevah verjetno da ima za to tudi pravno in ne iz zadnjice potegnjeno podlago in da verjetno tožena stranka ne bi pred temi organi nastopala tudi kot tožnik, če temu ne bi bilo tako in da se načeloma to ne rabi dokazovati, ampak se lahko predvideva, da je temu tako?

Wat?
Neresno trolanje JS @ https://github.com/paxman/ZDIJZovanje
Za tenorista me imajo: BSi, Policija, MF.
Kar pogreje me pri srcu!
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